Bill Hull writes...
"Obedience to the Great Commission hinges on three things:
1) An intentional plan that defines and trains disciples.
2) A commitment to reproduction by training evangelism with accountability.
3) And, a commitment to multiplication by special training in order to produce disciple making leaders.
These are the bare bones and anything less is disobedience."
Bill Hull in "Disciple Making Pastor."
These things are defined and living in action through the Disciple Driven Church. God is birthing a movement of disciple multiplying leaders and Christ followers. Are you in? Or are you satisfied with anything less than the bare essentials? Be careful how you answer. Your answer will curse or bless you.
posted by Bob Carder @ 10:50 PM
5 comments
5 Comments:
Good (sunday) morning, Bob.
Personally, I struggle a bit with Hull's observations here (haven't read the book, so I'm just commenting on the quotes presented). Specifically, two things:
1. Discipleship is reduced to a strategy to reinvigerate the life of the church and produce growth. In this sense the discipleship movement becomes nothing more than the legitimate child of the church growth and seeker sensitive movement. It's built upon the same faulty presuppositions of modernity. Not that training isn't important, but it's not the hinge upon which obedience to the Great Commission rests, as Hull suggests.
2. The hinge is not training (or even obedience), but faith. This is what is so often missing from the discipleship process - especially in North America (even Europe generally does better than us in this). Discipleship is not firstly about obeying Jesus or imitating Jesus, but about trusting Jesus. I define discipleship as growing in faith, love, and obedience. But obedience is really more of an afterthought. When faith in God and love for others are present, the obedience tends to follow.
HSB - greetings. If what you say is true then we are in more trouble than we originally thought. Your thoughts carry deeper issues for the Church as the Body of Christ.
Then if I hear you, faith in God and love for others is sorely lacking among professing believers. Is that what you are saying.
When Christ followers have assumed that they do not have to personally engage deliberate disciple making and without being taught to engage they may never make the connection into out of church and into the world with active faith.
IMHO, a lack of faith and love are what weakens any local congregation or any individual Christian. As one who is actively seeking to be a part of discipleship movements around the world, I always begin by examining myself and the movements I'm a part of. That's why I come across as harder on the disciple-making movements than on the attractional churches. It's because I see the future in the disciple-making movements (though I believe that God will use a diversity of ministries and structures).
My critique of Hull is that he actually does what we're advocating against. He makes a program central to disciple-making. I engage in training people to make disciples, but it's not central to a disciple-making movement.
When Jesus made disciples he met them in their workplace and called them to follow him. He took them out into a boat in a storm (beyond their area of expertise) and taught them that he could be trusted. He taught them to socialize with the outcasts and the marginalized by taking them into the homes of tax collectors and sinners. He risked his reputation to love the unlovable.
The second problem I have (and I know this sounds weird) is that his statements are so focused on obedience (in spite of Matthew 28:19-20). Obedience is absolutely vital, but without faith and love it becomes legalism. I've witnessed some discipleship movements become incredibly legalistic because they're so focused on obedience. Obedience flows out of faith and love, so that has to be central to what I teach.
A bit rambled for early morning, but I hope you get the idea! :-)
I grow tired and weary of the latest trend in the church "we have found the best way method." Hate me if you will but I love the body of Christ. This body includes all who name the name of Jesus. If you really want to be a disciple of Jesus study his life as a student follows the rabbi. Join his Yeshiva and watch the every move of Jesus. When Jesus said to make disciples he defined the term.."teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you.." Show us your obedience by teaching others to obey the way of GRACE. Spend you days loving the church and give this bride your love and attention. Grab the WORD of God and cling to it. It is through the true emergence of the Word that real revival is wrought. Make your efforts count for the Kingdom. Love all and strive to no be a party to divisiveness and anger. Seek ye FIRST the Kingdom of God. Love God with all you've got...this sums up the Law and the Prophets..." This "movement" will only succeed in direct proportion to the humility of it's leaders and the hand of God. Make room brothers, the Holy Spirit might just demand we all be silent. He might have us all lose everything..He might just tell us loving Jesus is enough! I love you Bob Mark Springs
Yes Jesus told us to make disciples and teach them to obey.
We must teach our disciples the meaning of obedience to all the commands of Christ including the supreme Great Commission Command.
There is no right way thinking here. There is "only way thinking". That is obedience to personally make disciples is the "Only Way" to be obedient. "Teach them to obey all the commands."
The only ones who get defensive with this blog are those who are not making disciples as the personal mandate for all. Those are the ones who are accusing of thinking we have the RIGHT way of doing Church. There is no right way - there is an ONLY WAY! We must obey with a BIG PERIOD!
Love you also, Mark
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