Sunday, July 02, 2006

Hard Head and New Lessons

I am hard headed and because of that it takes a while to get through to me sometimes.
Such is the case with what I have to tell you. What I have to say is a God-given message I believe to be true and worthy of your time to read. Not a great article but a painfully true one.

I used to think that we could birth a new movement of organic ministry out of the Institutional Church in America. Well the last few days I have been slapped around a bit. I am reminded of Hagar and Sarah. Hagar gave birth because of what man can do. Sarah gave birth because of what only God can do. Herein lies the difference. Richard Green calls Americanized Christianity -Hagar, the church built on what man can do. He calls this Organic New Testament Church -Sarah, the Church build on what- only God can do.

While you are chewing on that let me add one more important Scriptural fact. Hagar and Sarah cannot live in the same tent. Which tells me that Institutional Church and Organic Church cannot cohabitate or live in the same tent. They could never give birth the other. Yet I'm in an Institution with a vision for Organic.

In order for the Organic to flow from the Institution -it needs to be released from the Institution and from the hoops, rules, red tape, control, and growth hindering accountability for her to take off. Actually in Organic Ministry there is more accountability from one another in the Organic Church holding each accountable to the truth of God's Word. Institutions don't do this well, they create systems and structure for full proof accountability which ends up halting the mission. Organic is unrestricted. Outside forces slow, or stop organic. In good soil the plant will grow unless some outside factor hinders it. (Insects, lack of water, storms, lack of sunshine, people, rules, hoops, structure -you got the picture.

Now that I have the New Lesson my Hard Head will come in handy. How much does the institution (Americanized Christianity) want God to work in a new wine skin? Do we want to struggle for the Institution to keep things status quo and not to effective in some places or do we want the joys of being in an organic growing and discipling Church free flowing in the presence of and with Holy Spirit power?

My hard head is going to come in handy when I confront the establishment of instutional control, hoops, red tape and road blocks for the sake of a Living Organic New Testament Church Holy Spirit birthing ministry.

Will Hagar (Institution) release Sarah (Organic) to live in separate tent? Will Hagar let Organic live in a separate tent in the same campground? Or will Institutional Church (Hagar) insist on Organic (Sarah)to live altogether in one big tent. If (Hagar) insists on living together, (Sarah) Organic will lose everytime because the Spirit of God and His nature will be quenched. Sarah and Hagar cannot live in the same tent--If Hagar insists on having humankinds way- the Holy Spirit will never force his desires on us. Organic will lose if not released from the Instutitution to do ministry differently or in a radical way leave the system -which could be healthy God directed rebellion. (Scriptures show plenty of examples if you need any.)

If denominational systems do not recognize this truth -Christianity will be even more stifled in America. Actually on the other hand Christianity might just grow Organically without them --which leaves denominations of control the odd guy out.

It's Time For this Wake Up Call for me, you and whoever wants to listen - that is if you don't think I've lost my mind..

14 Comments:

At July 02, 2006 10:25 PM, Blogger Dr. Terry M. Goodwin said...

Bob - whatever it takes as long as it is done God's way.
Before we blame everything on the institutional church let's remember a few things. Effective ministries will be converting people from the same culture that is corrupting Hagar. Hagar never intended to turn out this way. I have never been in a church that started with the vision - To make God led ministry difficult and sprit filled disciples unusual - I am reading a book called Theology of the Reformers. The beginning was a new wine skin as you put it. Before we abandon the old for the new let's identify where it went wrong before. I think the American church has one last chance to get it right. Another system that skims the devoted from the establishment without fixing the long term problem will just end up corrupted again in the future. Remember that Luther did not fight the church because it demanded too much but because it demanded too little. I have the fire of God burning within me to help reform this American church. I am not ready to abandon it but rather to reform it from the ground up if needed. Ask people to live for God. Lead by example. Utilize prayer as a primary function of the church. I still believe that one voice can call Ninevah to repent in one day if God directs the voice. If we must leave Hagar in order to get it done then let's remember to seek answers from God before we start fresh. Then let's focus on leading Hagar to the Lord!

 
At July 02, 2006 10:34 PM, Blogger Bob Carder said...

Terry,
Good comments, cannot wait to meet you. Are you in town this week?

 
At July 02, 2006 10:40 PM, Blogger Bob Carder said...

Terry, Oh yes, I do understand that in both camps and any other God will be winning the lost.

My point it is either Hagar or Sarah. Both will win lost people -one is gripped with man made laws and the other flows with the spirit. One is built with a primary focus on what man does (our systems) and the other build on what God does (his way the organic way). The two streams do not merge they converge.

I am hoping to challenge the American Church and be her voice in the winderness calling out for redemption and to get it right. Someone has to speak out as you have read from this and other posts.

I have not given up on the American Tradtional Church -I work with her, coaching her, and leading her in getting healthy. That's why I fly to Portland every month for a few days to do what I can to see new life spring out.

While I have not given up on her--I remain hard on her.

 
At July 03, 2006 7:12 AM, Blogger Dr. Terry M. Goodwin said...

Its time for a new reformation. Its time for the body of Christ to act like a body. Christ asked people to leave mother and brother and houses and land for his sake. He told the rich to sell all they own and give it to the poor. James could not imagine a faith that did not produce good works and questioned if that faith could save you. Paul outlined how the church is to be an interdependent free sharing of lives, gifts and resources. I want to be in the church that preaches and lives these messages.

Bob - I am free all week. Let's get together and get something started here in St. Louis.

 
At July 03, 2006 7:17 AM, Blogger Bill said...

Just to tag-team off what Terry said in his first comment here...remember, the problem with Hagar didn't begin with Hagar. It began with Abraham's unfaithfulness.

The institutional church is what it is because we have made it that way.

I agree...we are in the midst of a new reformation and I can't believe I am blessed enough to live during this time to experience it...and contribute to it.

 
At July 03, 2006 10:24 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Bill: You rawk, dude!

Sorry, too much coffee this morning, but I knew there was something that wasn't sitting right with me in this whole Hagar/Sarah comparison.

You hit the nail on the head.

I don't say that to negate any of the discussion about the viability of either of these systems. But I do think we miss something if we don't like at the complete picture. Something we should learn from.

I like what you said, "the institutional church is what it is because we made it that way." Amen! Do I dare suggest we could, if we chose, 'unmake' it? But that would ruin the whole Hagar/Sarah metaphor...

Abraham couldn't undo his faithlessness anymore than Hagar could undo her pregnancy. Oh no, now am I convincing myself of Bob's position?

But wait, wasn't it Sarah who suggested that Abraham lay (great term! so pristine...) with Hagar?

Metaphors can get tricky sometimes.

 
At July 03, 2006 10:26 AM, Blogger Bob Carder said...

You all are sounding more Holy Spirit led "Organic" every day.

God bless you for seeing that God wants to break through our our old paradigms to breath new life into the His Church without restrictions or boxes that hinder Him.

 
At July 03, 2006 6:03 PM, Blogger Ricky said...

Bob, did you find Richard Green's comments that you mentioned in a book?

If so, would you please advise of the title?

Thanks.

 
At July 04, 2006 9:33 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

About 11 years ago I jumped out of a perfectly good airplane. Standing on the deck, feeling the wind, heart racing, feeling like I was going to be sick was the strangest, most terrified feeling I ever had before or since. We (the instructor and I) jumped, the wind rushed. It was so loud that had I not been concentrating on all my "keys" during free fall I would have covered my ears (good thing it was loud, the noise masked by screaming like a little girl). After what seemed like a blink, I pulled the cord, there was a sudden upward pull, and then total silence. Total peace, total calm. I will never do it again but I will carry the lessons forever. Bob, when you jump(and I am convinced you will jump eventually, you have been standing on the deck for some time now and did not even recognize it) remember others have jumped before you. We are experienced, we will lift you up in prayer and we will walk next to you as best as humanly possible. The rush will initially be overwhelming, the noise from those around you will be deafening. A sudden jerk as God reorientates you to living his will rather than a denominational will and then peace, silence, calm. Total freedom. Blessings

 
At July 05, 2006 7:02 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wow. Beautiful. Really.

 
At July 05, 2006 7:10 AM, Blogger Bill said...

Jim,

I hope you don't mind, but I posted your comment here on my blog. www.epicaugusta.typepad.com.

Your thoughts here moved me this morning as I wrestle with much of the same that Bob is wrestling with.

Thanks for sharing this.

 
At July 05, 2006 7:11 AM, Blogger Bill said...

I will add, that this is a lonely jump. We often make it all alone with nobody by our side. The lonliness is sometimes unbearable.

 
At July 05, 2006 7:14 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Bill

Just as I was tied to an instructor we are all strapped to the Master and because He is our vine we are all branches together of the same plant.

Peace

 
At July 05, 2006 10:07 AM, Blogger Bob Carder said...

Ricky - Richard Green is our Missionary and did Organic ministry in Africa. He actually does this teaching for all of our Missionaries.

In fact this month every missionary in the Missionary Church will take this extensive and intensive training. We have decided that missionaries who do not make disciples who make disciples should not be on the field.

Anyway, Richard also trains foreign leaders here at Keystone S.D. during the winter monthes. We have leaders bringing nationals to Keystone and then pays for their lodging, food and travel so they can come and learn and then go home and do it organically.

I have the teaching and I may be able to send it to you, just email your contact info and I'll do what I can. bcarder@centurytel.net

 

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