Did someone say, STORIES?
By some incredible act of grace, I have been allowed to be in the midst of a Holy Spirit birthed disciple making movement of God.
Let me share this excerpt from my life in this new work.
Take our worship gatherings as an example. Our gatherings take virtually no human planning or preparation other than sitting at the feet of Jesus daily. When all the gifts of the Body are working together the worship gathering looks more like a carefully planned Holy Spirit orchestra resulting in a God like performance. As God prompts believers those believers share and then they pray and then rebuke or correct and then they share a word from the Lord or whatever. No two gatherings are ever the same because God works through the entire Church family of God. In the end there is always a Holy Spirit orchestrated theme or threads for the day.
I love the fact that none of this is man driven. It's all about the Holy Spirit working His orchestration in the lives of God's children. I love watching the Church function as God intended.
posted by Bob Carder @ 9:02 AM
33 comments
33 Comments:
To Rick.
You have been asking for stories so take your pick.....
We have had people healed of bipolar, depression, what the medical world would call schizophrenia but was actually demonic possession, we watched people turn to Christ, go out and lead another to Christ make a disciple and baptize their own disciple within the month. We have heard chains of bondage break, seen people freed of pornography, homosexuality, OCD. We have seen people give over to God hate, bitterness, anger, and unforgiveness. People were lead to take power in Christ and they gave up smoking, sorcery, satanic metal and drugs. People have cast demons out, rebuked the possessed and silenced them, rebuked the possessed and stopped them in their tracks. People have gained impossible knowledge about others they had no way at all of knowing and had it confirmed by others and helped free people with that knowledge. We have seen a man who was supposed to die come to Christ and get out of his hospital bed and join us in worshiping Christ. There have been visions that came true (none that have shown false), people getting insight into the spiritual realm. We have seen the homeless dedicate themselves to discipleship, the mentally challenged, the rejected.
Now the question, do you believe me?
If you do not believe me here, then there is no point in me going into details about any of the stories.
Can you tell me with all honesty before Christ that you believe me in all these things I just wrote? If not, I am not telling you any stories because you will not believe the power of God anyway. If you do believe me completely, then do you have similar stories about what God has done in your ministry (no sarcasm here at all, completely serious)?
Living in the natural and spiritual realms is quite a ride. Most of my life was spent living in the Physical realm with Logos Truth.
Now I'm living in the natural and spiritual realms and the Holy Spirit is revealing "rhema" truth revelation. It's amazing how different my sermons would be (if I was preaching) but then again every post reveals the theme.
thanks, Eric!
I've been amazed at the transformation of those in your mentally challenged church. These young adults really get it, don't they?
Awesome rick. I caught your comment on the other one.
Can you give us a quick recap like I just did of your ministry? Which of these things have you seen in your ministry in the last year? (That all happened within the last 12 months or so by the way)
Eric Wilson
Thanks for sharing - It is AWESOME! I am thankful for the work God is doing in your midst!
I too am seeing God at work. I serve in an area of ministry that sees students come to life in Christ daily. It is so impressive to be part of something and use my gifts for His glory.
Recently God brought emotional healing to a student who was plaqued with hurt and deep-seeded distructive patterns. Her testimony of victory in Christ is remarkable.
I have the fortunate blessing of sharing these life-changing stories with Alumni. Often I say, "See what God is doing at IWU!" It is for His glory.
I have been a part of the life-changing impact of one of our former foster girls. After many years of prayer she has remarkably found Christ. This girl led distructive patterns of pornography, sex, drinking, drugs, jail ... she is a glowing testimony of God's grace. She now leads Bible Studies with her friends whom she formerly did drugs with.
I have led AA groups where the power of Christ is obvious and life change is happening.
I have been part of jail ministry and ministry to low-income families who have seen the power of God in their lives. the jail ministry I began 8 years ago reported over 90 conversion testimonies last year. The ministry of Alpha Bible studies has changed lives and inmate now lead these Bible studies.
I have shared Christ with police officers and prayed with them while doing ride-alongs.
I am working even now to bring the power of God through Bible Study and prayer to co-workers -- even at a place like IWU, there are many life-changing examples.
Thanks for letting God use you and for sharing your examples. I believe that this upward momemtum will catch on! Keep the stories coming.
I appreciate your examples. I have some questions though.
"""""the jail ministry I began 8 years ago reported over 90 conversion testimonies last year."""""
Awesome. How many of them are living a Christian life today? How many have after they left jail? Are they all living for Christ today?
""""I too am seeing God at work. I serve in an area of ministry that sees students come to life in Christ daily. It is so impressive to be part of something and use my gifts for His glory.""""""
How many of them stay with Christ 10 years later and follow Him to the end? A huge problem in the church I used to be a part of was this, hundreds would say the prayer and come to Christ, but few if any had anything to do with Christ a year later.
""""I have led AA groups where the power of Christ is obvious and life change is happening."""""
Did you mention Christ in the AA meeting you were leading?
""""I have shared Christ with police officers and prayed with them while doing ride-alongs."""""
How did God show up? What happened with them?
Eric, Sometimes the "not sure I believe" can come from not knowing you personally. If I am skeptical it is because of other believers who have made claims of living in the spiritual but in reality all was man made.
That is fine martilou, but I am not going to waste my time telling stories of what God has been doing, if they are not going to be believed.
i think i would be wary of the demon possession stuff. my question is how do you cast them out? is there a special phrase that you say or do you hold up a cross and such? if that is it, you border on magic. one ought to be careful about what they call demon possession. this is a very serious thing. possession deals with the minions of the prince of the air. if you are not truly in Christ and entirely sanctified, you can be in great danger! really what you are calling demon possession is likely just a medical condition that results from the fall. you can pray for healing, but should not be casting out demons...that gives too much credit to the enemy. in the new testament there were a lot of casting out of demons, but i think this was something far worse than mere medical conditions and diseases. Jesus healed diseases, but when he cast out demons, it was something more. i think demon possession is very rare today, perhaps the tactics of Satan have changed. in the new testament, he was really working hard because he knew the victory of Christ was at hand. i think he has changed his tactics nowadays, at least in north america and europe.
i am a prostestant turned roman catholic. ifound this blog in a recent search and found some curious things. here, i just am cautious about charismatic movements like this.
Levi - I don't want to be labeled charismatic because it is much different than that. Charismatic carries with it lots of baggage and sometimes weirdness.
What I have seen and experienced is true and authentic New Testament stuff.
When I witnessed three demons speak out and then later come out it was God glorifying. I also know that demons fear God and His judgment. In the last case, one the demons begged us to let it stay inside the person for fear of God's judgment. It cried out to us for mercy - but demons do not get mercy and was cast out. You are right that we must exercise great discernment in demonic exorcism but we need not fear them. Many people have opened the door to demonic activity and we believe this demonic activity must be driven out in order for their to be victory.
In America demonic activity is more hidden but just as much alive. We see demonic oppression and possession because we are looking for it. And believe me the signs are clear as we look.
I can assume that if you have never had a demon talk back to you through a person it will leave you a bit unsettled to say the least.
But, we take them on - head on - and they have to leave. The Bible says that one should not be quick to lay hands on a person especially in the case of demonic activity. Jesus came to "set the captives free."
The last demon I faced -kicked me, hit me and threw a chair at me, cursed me, accused me, screamed at me and cried out for mercy all in the same night for the part I was involved. It latter did other bizarre and unsettling things.
The reason the demon surfaced was because I confronted and antagonized it. Demons love to have an audience and I did this in front of others. Later the audience was dismissed while we the team tackled the forces that were present.
Jesus and His word show us clearly how to handle these types of things. Believe me, demons are very active in America - they are just hiding out here.
Perhaps some in our movement can share here how they have been delivered. Perhaps others around the world will like to weigh in.
""""i think i would be wary of the demon possession stuff. my question is how do you cast them out? is there a special phrase that you say or do you hold up a cross and such?"""""
No. We have power in Christ over demons.
""""one ought to be careful about what they call demon possession"""""
You mean like when a person hears the demon tell them its name? Or when the person's voice changes and they shout "You will never cast me out!" and then it curses at you?
""""if you are not truly in Christ and entirely sanctified, you can be in great danger!""""
Agreed.
""""Jesus healed diseases, but when he cast out demons, it was something more. """""
Agreed. So did all demons magically just die off?
""""i think demon possession is very rare today, perhaps the tactics of Satan have changed.""""
LOL That is really funny. Satan did not change for thousands of years, used the same old lies but told his entire army to retreat?
I used to think possessions were rare too. Then I talked to people and found out that is not true. There are probably about 5 or 6 or so people set free over here that actually heard the demon tell them it's name. A lot of people are possessed whether you will believe it or not. I have seen it. Just because you haven't doesn't mean that Satan changed. Don't be fooled.
Response to comments by eric...
Jail ministry - tough to answer fully because we don't always know there they end up: some were released, some were sent to a federal or state prison.
Students - our studies in this indicate that a large % (majority) of our students are following and even leading in Christian organizations today - after 10 years. Our core curriculam is designed to develop Christian leaders "World Changers." We have research on our traditional program (meaning our College of Arts and Sciences).
AA - YES, we presented Christ! We were registered as an AA group that enabled Bible Studies where Christ was central...not this "higher power" stuff.
One officer refused to remove his WWJD bracelet while receiving ritucule for his faith and was actually demoted for his commitment to Christ. He rejoiced for being a passionate follower of Christ. One other officer who hated Christians became my friend as well as a follower of Christ. One other officer leads a prayer meeting at the station for officers before his shift begins.
Of these, they are still following Christ.
You?
It is sad that the jail ministry was not possible for you to keep up with them and have people continue to disciple them. Just an hour ago I was ridding my bike and I stopped at a park. While I was there I met two men from a jail ministry who just got out a few months ago. They came to Christ in jail in a jail ministry and they are not currently living for Christ. When they got out of jail, I got the feeling no one said anything to them after that. Now they are not living a Christlike life. I spoke to them about discipleship and we are supposed to talk more tomorrow. A huge problem I have seen with "churches" is continuing with the people they see come to Christ. There needs to be continual relationships there. There is no excuse for people to get lost in the shuffle.
Me what exactly? I don't know what you mean "you?" can you ask a specific question?
levi, a question for you-
When you look at the world around you, at the eating disorders, school shootings, rapes, murders, sexual immorality, and this is just America, what convinces you that Satan is NOT at work?!?!?
I will challenge you on this. You say "really what you are calling demon possession is likely just a medical condition that results from the fall." what peice of Scripture makes you think that this is the case? As the scientific and medical worlds advanced, people began to see physical reasons for things, diseases, phenomenon, etc... BUT when these were found, somehow we automatically decided that there couldnt be any spiritual component to it either. WE HAVE GIVEN SATAN FREE REIGN BY MAKING THE SPIRITUAL ENTIRELY NATURAL!!!!!
and this makes me sick. the demonic oppression, suppression and possession that looks like mental disroders is turned into a genetic unconquerable roadblock and IT IS COPED WITH, NOT CONQUERED!!! even sexual immorality has become genetic!
take a good look at this. Jesus said that He came that we may have ABUNDANT LIFE! ANYTHING LESS THAN THAT IS NOT WHAT GOD HAS IN MIND!
you said that all these mental disorders came from the fall, but Jesus came to undo all of satan's works. ALL OF THEM!!!
Eating disorders, school shootings, rapes, murders, sexual immorality are some of the results of the Fall. They are not always demon possession. We have to be very careful about what we call demon possession.
I do not deny that Satan is alive and at work, but most of the bad in the world is the result of human bad choices as a fallen creature.
I think there is a difference between medical problems and demon possession. In the NT, Jesus healed the medical problems. When confronted with demon possession, he cast out the demons. There was a difference between these types of instances. Each problem had a different remedy that fit the specific need. This is why I do not think that what the NT characters called demon possession was what we would call medical problems. Demon possession is beyond the medical.
What you guys have described here, for the most part, seem to be medical conditions. I do believe in demon possession, but it has to be beyond the medical/physical.
I am just VERY cautious when it comes to this stuff. it is dangerous. I also think that we should not go out looking for demons. With the number of stories I see here, it seems that you go out to look for them and force a label on things without really looking in depth at it. that's all.
and i do agree that Christ came and reversed the Fall. As the second Adam, this was done. Satan is already defeated, and Christ is the victor.
yes Levi to your last comment.
No Levi - we do not just label something demonic. If it is demonic we deal with it and it is kicked out of the host.
You'll just have to trust us to use Holy Spirit discernment in the situations you mentioned above.
It's a very strong statement to label God's work as us forcing a label on it. That's like walking on thin ice. I'm not taking the glory back from God - He did the work you accuse us of not doing. It's just been really cool to see a glimpse into the Spirit realm and watch God kick butt.
of course, not every one we come across is possessed, that is to say completely demonically controled. many people are demonically terrorized from without, supressed or manipulated from within, or so influenced that they are completely obsessed with the sins that bind them and cant give them up.
But still, the fall was the first work of Satan, which means every result of the fall is a work of satan, which Jesus came to destroy.
""""
What you guys have described here, for the most part, seem to be medical conditions.""""""""
Someone hearing a demon tell them it's name is just a medical condition? You walk a fine line Levi when you said these things are not a result of demons. If you are there, and God shows you it is a demon, especially when it reveals its name, how can you deny that? There is even a spirit of deafness listed in the Bible. Does that mean EVERY deaf person is possessed? Of course not. It doesn't even mean most of them are. Most are not. However, we have come in contact with a LOT of people who are possessed or are terrorized demonically. It happens a lot. We have seen it. No, there are just sicknesses, however, some things by their very nature are not sicknesses but are spiritual issues. People tend to look at Africa and think all the demons are there, but it is just as bad over here, we are just used to it and unless you are asking God to reveal the spiritual to you then you probably will not notice.
i'm just heeding the wisdom found in C.S. Lewis's "The Screwtape Letters." He writes that Satan (aka. Our Father Below in the book) is just as pleased with both types of people: those that do not give any thought to him at all and do not believe he exists, AS WELL AS those who think about him too much, certainly sorcerers and witches, but even Christians who give him too much credit. Satan is real and is out there working, but I think far too often we give him too much credit, way more than what he deserves. He's a stinker and really doesn't deserve all the praise we Christians give him.
If you are hearing demons tell you their names, that is a pretty freaky and SERIOUS thing. We ought not take that stuff lightly. But we must also remember not to look for it if it is not there. We should not go out looking for demons to cast out...we are not ghostbusters.
...Some of my thoughts.
I agree Levi, but it is real and it does happen. A lot. I don't believe I give Satan any glory by warning Christians that he is real and active in the world. What are demons doing if they are not active in the world? Given, some are cast into the pit but what about all those which are not? What are they doing? Are they an organized force of evil or are they just sitting down there in hell not hurting anyone? If they are an organized force, if we are in a real spiritual battle, we need to be aware of what is around us and who is taking part in the battle.
I heard of this basic outline for testimonies: Thought I would share it with you.
Before Salvation:
I was ___________
I _____________
After Salvation:
I _____________
HE ____________
Fill in the blanks -
only problem with the outline rick, is it assumes that all good things start happening after salvation and that all bad things are before. for me, my life became immediately much worse after committed myself to the Lord. i mean, i was miserable before salvation, but i was bordering on insanity afterwards. on consecration started happening, though, THAT'S where the victory started happening
Zach...Huh? My outline assumes what? Your testimony please. What has God done for you since salvaltion? My outline is pretty open ended. I don't understand your statement ~ has not your life changed?
rick, sorry for any confusion, but my only point was that the outline is actually quite cut and dry. it makes it seem that life before salvation and after should be sherry and giggles. my life before WAS miserable, but the misery progressed two years after my salvation and got so bad that i was bordering on suicide most of my freshman year of college, if i wasnt rolling around in homosexual pornography or adoration and emulation of witchcraft.
as far as the testimony, do you want the whole thing, cause im not done writing it yet, and when i am, it will cover my entire life, and will be a continual description of the Spirit's working in my life. i can share what i have down now, if you like. but it may take a while for me to write. Ask bob, eric or terry (terry has known my family since before i knew who he was), i am NOT the person i was a year ago. so, how far down the rabbit hole do you want to go? do you want to hear about my salvation, how God brought me out of homosexuality, how He rescued me from my obsession with fantasy, witchcraft and Dungeons and Dragons, how He freed me from a demon that had plagued me for 15 years (including the three in which i was saved), how He rescued me from suicidal thoughts and fears, how i used to have 'imaginary friends' that wouldnt leave me alone and He freed me from them? How i used to be afraid that people would always hurt, abandon, fail, or leave me? How i used to be so many things that I NO LONGER AM?!?!?!
take your pick.
ps,
forget about the comment about the outline, i was in a "take everything WAY too serious" mode when i wrote the first comment. God's been stripping me of those as well. YAAAAYYYYY JESUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:)
How has your life changed Rick this year?
Rick, what Zach is saying is that transformation only barely started with your outline. His life has been turned inside out, upside down, to the north, east, west, and south. God has taken Him through the fire and is still not finished.
I used to put more emphasis on the altar/commitment experience and call that victory. Now I have come to believe that is only the first part of God's transforming work. Lots of stuff has to be dealt with. This is where our disciple making process engages the person with full force. Discipleship demands obedience and one has to be set free before that can occur.
We take all new believers through the Gates of Grace (our program) where all the gunk is uncovered and then dealt with.
Zach's conversion is not just a prayer away it was full of brokenness that led to God's transformation and healing.
MY life has also been turned upside down after all those years of preaching. The outline is only a starting point. The rest is full of fire.
God continue to refine me - through his refiners fire. This year he has especially taught me to be patient and depend upon Him more. You cannot believe how God has challenged me and how he has deepened the peace that passes all understanding. Challenges face all of us!
So what is He doing Rick? What does that look like? How has he changed you? How has God revealed himself to you? How do you serve Him different today than you did a year ago? What specifically has He challenged you in? What where you not previously depending on Him for?
I think the church has largely missed out on the joy of seeing people set free. We have been busy getting commitments and re-commitments to Jesus while many remain in their bondage. We have a church that is less than victorious. Jesus came to set the captives free and that's where we should lead every new and old Christ follower. I'm for a resurgence in setting the captives free from strongholds, generational sin and curses, satanic oppression & possession just to name a few. Let's close the door on everything that causes us not to be free in Christ.
I'm afraid I have led many people to Jesus and fewer still into freedom. I'm now leading people to the Jesus who sets the captives free by helping them discover the freedom Jesus wishes to offer every person who turns to Him. And, you would not believe the difference being totally set free makes.
I'm for seeing people become victorious.
my question is this:
when satan comes roaring, are you clinging in fear to anything you can hold onto? or do you stand firm and deliver him a quick Spirit-empowered kick to the face? Are you coping with sin, or are you victorious over it in Christ? are you dealing? or are you winning?
in short, are you free? note, there is no kinda free.
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