Monday, October 06, 2008

New Wine - New Wine Skins - New Release

Chuck Swindoll writes, "Our Lord distinguished between things that are essential (the wine: that is primary...the timeless and changeless gospel) and things that are useful but not primary (the skins:that which is secondary...like structures, traditions and fixed patterns of doing things.)

Jesus says, "He told them this parable: 'No one tears a patch from a new garment and sews it on an old one. If he does, he will have torn the new garment, and the patch from the new garment will not match the old. And no one pours new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the new wine will burst the skins, the wine will run out and the wineskins will be ruined. No, new wine must be poured into new wineskins. And no one after drinking the old wine wants the new, for he says, The old is better.'"

Isn't this a picture of the modern American Church? Our structures, traditions and fixed patterns for doing things have become primary instead of secondary? Isn't it true that we are comfortable to live in the old wine skin even at the expense of walking into a Holy Spirit revealed work? So many are saying, "The old wine is better."

It will take a new wine - a revisit back to what is really primary -the Gospel as applied in full Holy Spirit "rhema" anointing/importance and to do this we need to move out of the old skin and into new wine skins for ministry. A new Holy spirit revealed work "wine" demands new a wine skin.

We have confused the wine and wine skins. They are not on the same level nor are they the same thing.

God is revealing a new wine Holy Spirit revealed work for our day around the Great Commission mandate and now we need a new wine skin to hold it/guide it/express it. This is why I believe God has birthed the Disciple Driven Church. We had no choice but to move out so that we could express and walk in obedience in a newly Holy Spirit revealed WINE. This cannot be done in old wine skins. There is no way the modern American Church will personally and deliberately assume responsibility for the Great Commission mandate. This charge to obey is always met with resistance, so it seems. The personal engagement of the Great Commission is not what we were called into by man - it is what we have all been called into by God.

This call to personally obey the Great Commission for all believers must be a released work. As believers assume their responsibility to obey -they must be released to do so. As groups assume this Great Commission responsibility they must be released as well. If it is not released - living in this Truth will burst the old skins.

Let's talk about this - old/new wine, old/new wineskins, and keep/release ministry. I pray the Holy Spirit will open up some eyes on this post.

11 Comments:

At October 06, 2008 5:18 PM, Blogger Eric Wilson said...

No comments? That is strange.

 
At October 06, 2008 9:05 PM, Blogger Bob Carder said...

What do you mean, Eric?

 
At October 06, 2008 10:19 PM, Blogger Rev. Rick Carder '87 / ' 03 said...

"the wine: that is primary...the timeless and changeless gospel"
Agreed!

What do you mean when you say "God is revealing a new wine TRUTH (Revelation) for our day around the Great Commission mandate..."?

What do you mean when you day "The personal engagement of the Great Commission is not what we were called into by man - it is what we have all been called into by God."?

Is not any interpretation of man a man-made thing? How do you discern the difference?

Is revelation His? Is not the Bible the final authority? Is not the great commandment coupled with the great compassion of Christ (Matthew 25) - for unto the least of these...?

Fellow follower of Christ.

 
At October 07, 2008 9:30 AM, Blogger Bob Carder said...

comments withheld.

 
At October 07, 2008 11:46 AM, Blogger Dr. Terry M. Goodwin said...

Rick - if you hold that the wine = truth then you must hold that in order for there to be new wine there must be new truth.

Can there be new truth?

If Jesus is truth and Jesus is God then God = truth. If God is the same yesterday, today and forever than how can truth change?

Is it possible the wine = something other than truth?

 
At October 07, 2008 2:32 PM, Blogger Bob Carder said...

Chuck Swindoll believes that wine is Truth!

Terry what do you think the wine is?

 
At October 07, 2008 2:35 PM, Blogger Bob Carder said...

I just know that the wine is something God has birthed and it is fresh, vibrant, alive and setting the captives free.

 
At October 08, 2008 8:57 AM, Blogger Bob Carder said...

If the wine is not the Gospel - what is it?

 
At October 08, 2008 12:00 PM, Blogger Dr. Terry M. Goodwin said...

Bob - I am approaching this from a purely theological perspective. Some have accused people here of lacking in theology or doctrinal support for positions so as a recovering theologian working on a Ph.D in Theology at this time, I thought I would challenge the discussion.

If the new wine = truth then that says something about truth.

If the new wine is not truth then it must be something else. This needs to be understood.

When new wine is presented in the passage it is not compatible with the old wine skin but the old wine is. Can this really be truth? Can old truth and new truth be different? Can truth be contained in a wine skin if God is truth?

No matter what position you take on the new wine - it puts you into a myriad of other logical and theological conclusions. So choose wisely! Your answer will either define your view of how God reveals truth or it may just bring your logic crashing down.

I will withhold my position for now. Let the theologians chime in.

 
At October 09, 2008 9:28 AM, Blogger Bob Carder said...

I have come to believe that Chuck Swindoll has the wine skin correctly define but he does not correctly define the wine.

If the wine isn't the Gospel as he claims, what is it?

 
At October 09, 2008 9:35 AM, Blogger Bob Carder said...

RICK SAID: "the wine: that is primary...the timeless and changeless gospel"
Agreed!

The planter: I don't agree with Chuck!

What do you mean when you say "God is revealing a new wine TRUTH (Revelation) for our day around the Great Commission mandate..."?

The Planter: What I mean is God is revealing a Holy Spirit revealed work.

What do you mean when you say "The personal engagement of the Great Commission is not what we were called into by man - it is what we have all been called into by God."

The Planter: I mean we are not calling all believers to engage the Great Commission personally.

Is not any interpretation of man a man-made thing? How do you discern the difference?

The Planter: When God says something we should say the same thing and obey it too.

Is revelation His? Is not the Bible the final authority? Is not the great commandment coupled with the great compassion of Christ (Matthew 25) - for unto the least of these...

The Planter: All truth is God. The Logos and the Rhema. It is often coupled, but remember Jesus came back from the dead to remind us of our Great Commission responsibility. We should obey both.

 

Post a Comment

<< Home

Free Hit Counters